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PostPosted: Sat, 06-09-08, 19:04 GMT 
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Utopia? The problem is that there is a lot of almost similar textures for all the planets and moons.

I want a guide that can tell me what to do.

1. Why should i have DDS instead of PNG or jpg, and why should i use VT?

2. I use VT, but again... there is VT levels in jpg and DDS format. Can i mix them?

3. Lets say level 5 is dds, can level 6 be jpg?

4. If i have level 10 in jpg some place on earth, could dds be used in other level 10 areas?

5. Are all VT's compatible?

6. I want the best map/series of VT... Is it Jestr, John van Vliet, Cartrite or other mapmaker wich is best? I'll probably get the answer ... don't be lazy, find out for your self.. then look at Q nr 7.

7. My Celestia collection tends to grow out of proportions, i dont remember what map i installed, and again if i updated the solarsys.file to get it displayed thats why i dont want to find out by my self. Any solution to this common mess?

FINALLY:
I would like a table, whith rated maps for all planets an moons, if possible with a guide saying pick only one out of theese options.


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PostPosted: Sat, 06-09-08, 19:31 GMT 
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Welcome to the CM, Troxx!

Quote:
1. Why should i have DDS instead of PNG or jpg, and why should i use VT?

DDS is more memory-efficient for your computer. You can run higher resolution maps faster. PNG is better quality, but slower and demands much more memory. Jpg just sucks in both departments.

Quote:
2. I use VT, but again... there is VT levels in jpg and DDS format. Can i mix them?

No. That answers 3 and 4 too.

Quote:
5. Are all VT's compatible?

No. Different maps have different properties. It *can* be done, but they will sometimes not match. For example, a surface map from one set can have different coastline details from another, so the specular map for the first set will cause unwanted reflections if used with the other...

Quote:
6. I want the best map/series of VT... Is it Jestr, John van Vliet, Cartrite or other mapmaker wich is best? I'll probably get the answer ... don't be lazy, find out for your self.. then look at Q nr 7.

You get the very best maps right here, by producing them yourself with the f-tex-tools and nmtools... It will take you a couple of hours only. That is not to say other textures are bad, of course. Though some are.

Quote:
7. My Celestia collection tends to grow out of proportions, i dont remember what map i installed, and again if i updated the solarsys.file to get it displayed thats why i dont want to find out by my self. Any solution to this common mess?

Uh... Become aware of what you are doing might help.

Quote:
I would like a table, whith rated maps for all planets an moons, if possible with a guide saying pick only one out of theese options.

That is not easy to do - and incredibly time-consuming to do right. But if you start the job, i am sure you´d get help --> and a lot of bickering from the helpers :-D

- rthorvald


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PostPosted: Sat, 06-09-08, 21:56 GMT 
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Something new here, thanks for reply, I think many people is in my situation... with minimum of time to spend on figuring out how to create the ultimate map (that noone can make addons to)...

The job is to big, we all should have a standard, then I could have added my level 15 photos from paragliding over Norway. :-)


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PostPosted: Sun, 07-09-08, 10:37 GMT 
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Troxx wrote:
Something new here, thanks for reply, I think many people is in my situation... with minimum of time to spend on figuring out how to create the ultimate map


It will take you less time to produce the map with those tools than it will take to search and test other maps.

A hi-res list of ultimate Celestia maps is something everybody wants, but the job of defining it is enormous and cannot be done without both graphics and scientific expertise. So far, noone has had the time or inclination to try.

- rthorvald


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PostPosted: Sun, 07-09-08, 11:16 GMT 
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Troxx wrote:
Something new here, thanks for reply, I think many people is in my situation... with minimum of time to spend on figuring out how to create the ultimate map (that noone can make addons to)...

The job is to big, we all should have a standard, then I could have added my level 15 photos from paragliding over Norway. :-)


Sorry for intervening, but you are rather naive here, I am afraid.

Setting texture standards of highest quality that additionally incorporate the fast upgrading rate of scientific data from space missions, would need a fairly large team of image EXPERTS, working FULL TIME on such a task. You seem to have little idea how much work it is to assemble a hires texture from a huge number of individual shots, requiring reprojection of each shot and multi-layer work to smoothly match the mosaic boundaries etc...

We have spent a lot of thinking whether and how such a demanding task with our standards of high quality and timeliness could be handled. Unfortunately, it's VERY HARD...

Quote:
... with minimum of time to spend on figuring out how to create the ultimate map

That's another strange wording: are you expecting US to spend ALL our spare time on a task that allows YOU to loose no time? ;-) We all have demanding professions besides texture making, you know... The OpenSource idea is rather different: if YOU want things to progress faster, then YOU are invited to contribute your time and talent to make things faster...

That's the "price" for not having to pay money for such outstanding software as Celestia is.

Last not least, people with NO TIME will rather not be able to exploit much of such a rich and complex software like Celestia. It just takes practice and knowledge to exploit it. So with NO TIME there is not much to do anyway ... ;-)

Fridger


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PostPosted: Sun, 07-09-08, 18:23 GMT 
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t00fri wrote:
Troxx wrote:
Something new here, thanks for reply, I think many people is in my situation... with minimum of time to spend on figuring out how to create the ultimate map (that noone can make addons to)...

The job is to big, we all should have a standard, then I could have added my level 15 photos from paragliding over Norway. :-)


Sorry for intervening, but you are rather naive here, I am afraid.


It's a completely reasonable request. There absolutely should be a good set of high resolution textures for Celestia: one download with high quality DDS textures for all solar system bodies visited by interplanetary spacecraft.

Quote:
Last not least, people with NO TIME will rather not be able to exploit much of such a rich and complex software like Celestia. It just takes practice and knowledge to exploit it. So with NO TIME there is not much to do anyway ... Wink

But less time spent assembling a good set of textures means more time to explore Celestia itself.

--Chris


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PostPosted: Fri, 05-03-10, 10:30 GMT 
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Some time since last post :-)

To: t00fri
I don't expect anybody to do something for free for me... so thanks to all of you contributing to celestia with software and maps.

I know about "how much work it is to assemble a hires texture from a huge number of individual shots".

I'm not egoistic, like you seem to think. I would like to contribute to celestia, I just want a standard... right now it looks like mapcreators is making their own rather than cooperating on one map. If there was/is a common grid, i think we could cooperate.


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PostPosted: Fri, 05-03-10, 17:40 GMT 
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Troxx wrote:
Some time since last post :-)

To: t00fri
I don't expect anybody to do something for free for me... so thanks to all of you contributing to celestia with software and maps.

I know about "how much work it is to assemble a hires texture from a huge number of individual shots".

I'm not egoistic, like you seem to think.

Excellent ;-)
Quote:
I would like to contribute to celestia, I just want a standard... right now it looks like mapcreators is making their own rather than cooperating on one map. If there was/is a common grid, i think we could cooperate.

Besides devotion, the making of good textures requires a solid fundament of image manipulation know-how. I have no information about yours, of course. As to texture standards, you should perhaps distinguish between many submissions made at the Motherlode and what appears acceptable for the Celestia distribution, where we have quite well-defined standards. All texture contributions at the Motherlode are user efforts and unrelated to the Celestia development team. Many recent textures in the official distribution have been done by me. However, since some time, I am focussing my efforts to my forthcoming Celestia.Sci project.

As to Celestia.Sci, my aim is actually to achieve a standardized texture "fidelity", defined solely in terms of the original scientific input data and the output from my texture tools (see http://forum.celestialmatters.org/viewforum.php?f=6).

Celestia.Sci will actually include a semi-automatic download of hires textures, based at Celestial Matters. The hires set will also include virtual textures (VTs), as obtained in highest quality with my texture tools. Like e.g. VT's from the new (Feb 10, 2010) release of Tethys (11k) and Enceladus (14k) maps by the Ciclops team.
http://forum.celestialmatters.org/viewtopic.php?t=363

The procedure will be similarly automatic as the optional large star field downloads in Stellarium. The big advantage being that many textures of poor or uneven quality will become redundant, the new hires maps will be state-of-the-art and will surely show lots more fascinating detail! Since space missions (Ciclops,...) have now started to target really hires maps (16k,...) it would be a pity to vast the opportunity of corresponding hires visualization.


Fridger


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PostPosted: Sat, 06-03-10, 0:16 GMT 
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Quote:
right now it looks like mapcreators is making their own rather than cooperating on one map.

true some of us differ on our "tastes "

t00fri and I have a different idea , and i do understand his point of view.
( no arguing here , and no flamming please)
but it is like getting a room full of cats to do what a person wants them to do .

t00fri also WANTS people to learn something and make there own maps , very commendable but some people will never get past the MS " point and click" stage .

so the idea of auto DL's is great , something i would have liked to have seen a few years ago .
Quote:
If there was/is a common grid, i think we could cooperate.

well for VT's there is a "std" in size 512x512 px
but I like the png format , some like the jpg ( for the size , even with the loss of data) , some like dds ( do not get me started on dds and celestai )

so yes a roomful of cats .

_________________
"I don't pitch Linux to my friends, I let Microsoft do that for me."
Using OpenSUSE 42.1 & Scientific Linux 6.7


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PostPosted: Sat, 06-03-10, 11:50 GMT 
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t00fri wrote:
As to Celestia.Sci, my aim is actually to achieve a standardized texture "fidelity", defined solely in terms of the original scientific input data and the output from my texture tools (see http://forum.celestialmatters.org/viewforum.php?f=6).
Fridger


To this, I can only offer my heart-felt thanks...
I already know that your textures are the best in the Universe when it comes
to "original scientific input data," and this is what Celestia is all about
in my opinion.

Again, many thanks for doing these things for us Brain-Dead, non-scientist
types too. :D


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