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PostPosted: Sun, 17-01-16, 22:45 GMT 
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Posts: 27
I understand I have been warned to not post inquiries on mod files for fictional items prior. According to one administrative body, his quote being:

"This stuff is off-limits here. There are enough sites out there specializing on this."

I have already exhausted all means for assistance for this item, but I've run into this final barricade: there ARE no active sites capable of assistance with this. I've attempted to email the creator of the mod file, but all I got was a permanent failure when attempting to deliver the email to the creator. I have no other means of getting any sort of support for this mod with the possible exception of the Celestial Matters forum (and risking the ire of an administrator who has already warned me not to proceed with this).

My gamble here is to bypass the fictional stipulation by withholding the names in a sanitized copy-and-paste of my original inquiry to the author that was never answered.

My issue is:

There is an issue regarding your (original creator name) [name withheld] add-on for Celestia. I've relocated the [name withheld] stars to their respective positions according to the [name withheld] wiki and star maps (near the constellation Cassiopeia). The problem I'm encountering with the .dsc file: no matter how I try to change its coordinates when I open the .dsc file as a text file, it will not change its apparent position on Celestia. The unmodified parameters as they appear on your [name withheld] mod:

Nebula "[name withheld]"
{
InfoURL "http://[url hyperlink withheld]"
Mesh "[name withheld].3ds"
Emissive true
RA 192.81391772
Dec 118.62254013
Distance 125.729
Radius 0.1
}

The information modified; my attempt to place the nebula in its new location:

Nebula "[name withheld]"
{
InfoURL "http://[url hyperlink withheld]"
Mesh "[name withheld].3ds"
Emissive true
RA 12.90
Dec 64.5
Distance 68
Radius 0.1
}

Is there some kind of write-protect on the file that prevents it from changing its location on the program no matter how I try to alter its coordinates? I'm at a loss. I look forward to your reply. Thank you.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Unfortunately, my post was never answered on the Celestia Motherlode, and I doubt the creator's inbox still exists as I got a Permanent Failure when attempting to communicate with him. Once again, I'll repeat my rebuttal to any possible infractions: there ARE no active sites capable of assisting me with my issue.


Attachments:
File comment: Where the nebula should have moved to after setting the new coordinates.
Unnamed Nebula 02.png
Unnamed Nebula 02.png [ 400.91 KiB | Viewed 1624 times ]
File comment: Where the nebula appears vs. the new coordinates.
Unnamed Nebula 01.png
Unnamed Nebula 01.png [ 370.01 KiB | Viewed 1624 times ]

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PostPosted: Mon, 18-01-16, 8:53 GMT 
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Posts: 4496
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Quote:
But please no further STARFOX (http://starfoxwiki.info/wiki/Corneria)
or StarWars specific modelling in CelestialMatters!

This stuff is off-limits here. There are enough sites out there specializing on this.

Fridger


Yes this was me. You are welcome to try creating (and displaying) your own fictitious objects of the Universe and certainly may receive advice about these creative attempts by experienced CM members.

What is off limits here is to display copies of StarWar and STARFOX related images in Celestial Matters. I don't want to see here any copies of space ships(StarWars) for example! This strict request comes from very bad experiences we made along similar lines with the original Celestia site (shatters.net).

Fridger

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PostPosted: Mon, 18-01-16, 14:05 GMT 
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Location: Upstate NY, USA
The original DSC entry has two errors which combine so they seem to be almost right.

Part of the apparent placement problem is caused by the fact that DSC files require the Right Ascension to be specified in fractional Hours between 0 and 24. The author of the original Addon seems to have mistakenly provided the RA value in Degrees (which is what's used in STC file). That large of an RA value actually "wraps around the sky" several times.

Similarly, Declination values should be between +90 and -90 degrees, so a declination of 118 wraps around, too.

That combination of errors happens to result in a position which is near the one that you specified.

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PostPosted: Tue, 19-01-16, 4:56 GMT 
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Selden wrote:
The original DSC entry has two errors which combine so they seem to be almost right.

Part of the apparent placement problem is caused by the fact that DSC files require the Right Ascension to be specified in fractional Hours between 0 and 24. The author of the original Addon seems to have mistakenly provided the RA value in Degrees (which is what's used in STC file). That large of an RA value actually "wraps around the sky" several times.

Similarly, Declination values should be between +90 and -90 degrees, so a declination of 118 wraps around, too.

That combination of errors happens to result in a position which is near the one that you specified.


I was under the impression that the Right Ascension was the 24 hour system converted into the 365 degree system. It worked for the stars, so I don't know how else to get it to work for the nebula. When you said the "combination of errors" happened to result in a position which is near the one that I specified, did you mean in between Ursa Major and Draco (where the original parameters placed it beforehand) or near Cassiopeia (where I wanted it to go)?

If the parameters are supposed to be in RA 0-24 and Dec -90 - +90, what is the correct verbiage to place the nebula to encapsulate these stars?

650058 "[name withheld] A"
{
RA 12.90
Dec 64.5
Distance 68
SpectralType "B0V"
AppMag 0.00077
}

650068 "[name withheld] B"
{
RA 12.89998994
Dec 64.502
Distance 67.99965
SpectralType "M6.5V"
AppMag 7.7
}

650069 "[name withheld] C"
{
RA 12.90900998
Dec 64.49999997
Distance 67.99983
SpectralType "D"
AppMag 0.77
}

650070 "[name withheld] D"
{
RA 12.90000124
Dec 64.5000001
Distance 67.99977
SpectralType "M6.5V"
AppMag 8.7
}

650071 "[name withheld] E"
{
RA 12.88000998
Dec 64.49999997
Distance 67.99983
SpectralType "M3.0V"
AppMag 10.77
}

650072 "[name withheld] F"
{
RA 12.89000124
Dec 64.4960001
Distance 67.99977
SpectralType "M6.5V"
AppMag 8.7
}

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PostPosted: Tue, 19-01-16, 20:26 GMT 
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360 degrees is 24 hours in RA, so 360 divided by 24 is 15.

So to convert straight from hours to degrees, multiply your number by 15.

To convert straight from degrees to hours, divide your number by 15.

Hope this helps. :)


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PostPosted: Tue, 19-01-16, 22:36 GMT 
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The different conventions for RA units in DSC and STC files is a bug in Celestia that cannot be fixed because of backwards compatibility issues (I'm not speaking for Celestia.Sci here - not sure if there are any plans to break backwards compatibility with old Celestia add-ons). It was one of the motivations for introducing the ability to explicitly specify what units you were using -can't remember which Celestia version this was released in though.


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PostPosted: Thu, 21-01-16, 12:49 GMT 
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First: there's a bug in the STC information provided above: the first two stars have the same catalog number. Their numbers should be different. As it is, the second one replaces the first.

At any rate, here's an approximate DSC catalog entry:

Nebula "[name_withheld]"
{ Mesh "[name_withheld].3ds"
Radius 10 # LY
RA 0.87 # hours: 13 degrees * (24/360)
Dec 66.0 # degrees
Distance 68 # LY
}

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PostPosted: Fri, 29-01-16, 3:55 GMT 
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Selden wrote:
First: there's a bug in the STC information provided above: the first two stars have the same catalog number. Their numbers should be different. As it is, the second one replaces the first.

At any rate, here's an approximate DSC catalog entry:

Nebula "[name_withheld]"
{ Mesh "[name_withheld].3ds"
Radius 10 # LY
RA 0.87 # hours: 13 degrees * (24/360)
Dec 66.0 # degrees
Distance 68 # LY
}


Actually, the 1st 2 stars on my STC file DO have different catalog numbers:

...58 vs ...68 (...fifty-eight vs. ...sixty-eight).

I appreciate your input on the DSC file, and I will attempt to sandbox a new .txt file with the changes. I will respond with feedback after attempting this. Thank you for your assistance.


650058 "[name withheld] A"
{
RA 12.90
Dec 64.5
Distance 68
SpectralType "B0V"
AppMag 0.00077
}

650068 "[name withheld] B"
{
RA 12.89998994
Dec 64.502
Distance 67.99965
SpectralType "M6.5V"
AppMag 7.7
}

650069 "[name withheld] C"
{
RA 12.90900998
Dec 64.49999997
Distance 67.99983
SpectralType "D"
AppMag 0.77
}

650070 "[name withheld] D"
{
RA 12.90000124
Dec 64.5000001
Distance 67.99977
SpectralType "M6.5V"
AppMag 8.7
}

650071 "[name withheld] E"
{
RA 12.88000998
Dec 64.49999997
Distance 67.99983
SpectralType "M3.0V"
AppMag 10.77
}

650072 "[name withheld] F"
{
RA 12.89000124
Dec 64.4960001
Distance 67.99977
SpectralType "M6.5V"
AppMag 8.7
}

-------------------------------------------------------------
*Edit:
The changes as posted by Selden has indeed relocated the nebula. However, I had intended to have the nebula engulf the system of [unspecified] stars, and 10 LY was too great a span, so I reduced it to 0.1. Since he assisted with providing correct parameters, I've since modified the DSC file further. The new (and working) changes are:

Nebula "[name withheld]"
{
Mesh "[name withheld].3ds"
Emissive true
Radius 0.1 # LY
RA 0.86 # hours: 13 degrees* (24/360)
Dec 64.5 # degrees
Distance 68 # LY
}

Selden, thank you for your help.

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